Wilson vs Kaepernick comparison

[bobflipaburger]

Good to see you came around about young Russell Wilson.. You sure fought me on it last year.. haha

He still sheds a single tear every time he opens his closet and sees his Flynn jersey hanging there.

 

[#ONE]

He still sheds a single tear every time he opens his closet and sees his Flynn jersey hanging there.

I shipped it off to Africa along with a few boxes of "SF 49ers SB 47 Champions" tshirts.

 

[#ONE]

Good to see you came around about young Russell Wilson.. You sure fought me on it last year.. haha

Never been happier to be wrong.

 

[sprhawk]

Never been happier to be wrong.

Are you really completely all in One? I honestly can't say I'm totally there. Hard to admit with his performance last year and everything we've seen and heard this off season, he's the real deal. Other than the height thing, I can't really say why I'm not completely all in.

Warning this statement can and will be taken the wrong way but I hate political correctness anyway so, what the hell. I've always thought if you could take the freakish athleticism of a star black QB and blend it with the intelligence of the star white QB you'd get a damn good QB. Just in my lab experiments he was taller.

Anything less than the Lombardi this season is going to be a hard pill to swallow. Correct me if you think I'm wrong but we've never had so many supporters and well wishers in our camp going into a season. Not that it isn't a good thing. Flying under the radar has been the status quo and made accepting defeat a little less painful.

I remember being in a state of shock for days after SB40 but I'm really proud of that team because no one believed they would accomplished what they did. Even at 13-3 we were the underdogs. It was so clear that Seattle was the better team to Al and John that they sounded sick pointing it out multiple times during the game. The better team didn't win today.

Not sure how I'll feel if this team falls short.

 

[TheBandwagon]

sprhawk you make some good points. I think deep down most Hawk fans probably think like you do. There's still the history of sub 6-foot QBs never winning a Super Bowl, there's still the question in a lot of people's minds about how effective Wilson can be throwing from the pocket, there's the low number of passing attempts and relatively low number of total passing yards in comparison to other top QBs, there's the fact that Wilson doesn't have a track record, having only been in the league for 1 season, and there's just that feeling that, well, it's the Seahawks we're talking about here. Having an elite QB and winning Super Bowls and all that, that just doesn't happen with the Seahawks. If there's a way for it to all go wrong, you can always rely on the Seahawks to find a way.

But there are obviously many reasons to be very optimistic about Wilson too. Many fans, you included, might not yet be all in on Wilson but Wilson is all in on Wilson. It's hard not to believe in him when he believes in himself so much. His self confidence is off the charts and unshakable and so he never gets rattled. So one tends to get the idea that when he's got the ball in his hands that something good is gonna happen every time. I don't think I ever got that feeling with Matt H, at least not in the same way.
One other thing to be optimistic about was the performance he put up in the Falcons loss. 445 total yards, 3 TD and 1 pick. And it wasn't like they lost because he made a critical mistake or threw a pick or something. The Hawks lost that game in spite of him, not because of him. He played like a SB champion QB and like someone who's got 4 or 5 years of playoff experience even though he was just a rookie. Not only did he have history going against him because of his height, but also because he was a rookie. But I think Wilson would have taken the Hawks all the way last year if everyone else would have just climbed aboard (actually everyone sort of was aboard except for the defense in the last 30 seconds) .

Still though, it was only over one season. He hasn't won any rings yet. If he's gonna be a top five QB you want to see him in the 4000-4500+ yard range, in total yards, passing yards or whatever, not in the 3000-3500+ range.
If he can improve and keep it going another season, then most of the nagging doubts that remain should be wiped out for good. But until then I don't really blame you for not being completely all in yet. I agree, you don't want to go overboard and get too carried away too soon so as not to set yourself up for disappointment. There's been plenty of that over the years for Seahawk fans.

 

[#ONE]

Are you really completely all in One? I honestly can't say I'm totally there. Hard to admit with his performance last year and everything we've seen and heard this off season, he's the real deal. Other than the height thing, I can't really say why I'm not completely all in.

Warning this statement can and will be taken the wrong way but I hate political correctness anyway so, what the hell. I've always thought if you could take the freakish athleticism of a star black QB and blend it with the intelligence of the star white QB you'd get a damn good QB. Just in my lab experiments he was taller.

Anything less than the Lombardi this season is going to be a hard pill to swallow. Correct me if you think I'm wrong but we've never had so many supporters and well wishers in our camp going into a season. Not that it isn't a good thing. Flying under the radar has been the status quo and made accepting defeat a little less painful.

I remember being in a state of shock for days after SB40 but I'm really proud of that team because no one believed they would accomplished what they did. Even at 13-3 we were the underdogs. It was so clear that Seattle was the better team to Al and John that they sounded sick pointing it out multiple times during the game. The better team didn't win today.

Not sure how I'll feel if this team falls short.

I wonder if this is what you got banned for from the other site.

 

[TheBandwagon]

I wonder if this is what you got banned for from the other site.

You referring to the black QB/white QB thing? I can see how that would get somebody banned too because oftentimes being politically correct has nothing to do with reality and everything to do with having your head buried in the sand.

 

[Cmoney]

sprhawk you make some good points. I think deep down most Hawk fans probably think like you do. There's still the history of sub 6-foot QBs never winning a Super Bowl, there's still the question in a lot of people's minds about how effective Wilson can be throwing from the pocket, there's the low number of passing attempts and relatively low number of total passing yards in comparison to other top QBs, there's the fact that Wilson doesn't have a track record, having only been in the league for 1 season, and there's just that feeling that, well, it's the Seahawks we're talking about here. Having an elite QB and winning Super Bowls and all that, that just doesn't happen with the Seahawks. If there's a way for it to all go wrong, you can always rely on the Seahawks to find a way.

But there are obviously many reasons to be very optimistic about Wilson too. Many fans, you included, might not yet be all in on Wilson but Wilson is all in on Wilson. It's hard not to believe in him when he believes in himself so much. His self confidence is off the charts and unshakable and so he never gets rattled. So one tends to get the idea that when he's got the ball in his hands that something good is gonna happen every time. I don't think I ever got that feeling with Matt H, at least not in the same way.
One other thing to be optimistic about was the performance he put up in the Falcons loss. 445 total yards, 3 TD and 1 pick. And it wasn't like they lost because he made a critical mistake or threw a pick or something. The Hawks lost that game in spite of him, not because of him. He played like a SB champion QB and like someone who's got 4 or 5 years of playoff experience even though he was just a rookie. Not only did he have history going against him because of his height, but also because he was a rookie. But I think Wilson would have taken the Hawks all the way last year if everyone else would have just climbed aboard (actually everyone sort of was aboard except for the defense in the last 30 seconds) .

Still though, it was only over one season. He hasn't won any rings yet. If he's gonna be a top five QB you want to see him in the 4000-4500+ yard range, in total yards, passing yards or whatever, not in the 3000-3500+ range.
If he can improve and keep it going another season, then most of the nagging doubts that remain should be wiped out for good. But until then I don't really blame you for not being completely all in yet. I agree, you don't want to go overboard and get too carried away too soon so as not to set yourself up for disappointment. There's been plenty of that over the years for Seahawk fans.

Um pretty sure Drew Brees won a super bowl and he is under 6 foot.

 

[bobflipaburger]

Drew Brees is a little over 6'0"

 

[TheBandwagon]

Brees, Theismann and Len Dawson were all listed at 6' even, the shortest QBs to ever win a Super Bowl but no one under 6' has ever won it or has ever even made it as far as I know. Pat Haden started for the Rams in '79 at 5'11 but wasn't playing after like week 8 that year. So there's a sort of 6 foot "barrier" that has been in place and if Wilson gets it done he'll be the first and only one in history to do so.

 

[sprhawk]

I wonder if this is what you got banned for from the other site.

Yep, more or less. Just happened this site was down when the NBA player came out of ye ole closet. Got banned for something about screws not holding things together without nuts. Some logical BS like that.

 

[#ONE]

Yep, more or less. Just happened this site was down when the NBA player came out of ye ole closet. Got banned for something about screws not holding things together without nuts. Some logical BS like that.

I personally am not offended by that stuff. I'm Ukrainian, a very ethnocentric and racist ethnic group. But at the same time I can see how that could be taken the wrong way. And it's not about political correctness, it's more about simple respect for your fellow man. Even if there is truth in what you say, sometimes, in a setting such as a football message board, it's better not to say 'intelligent white QB vs. Athletic but dumb black QB' even if most people would agree, it's better to not say stuff like that. Something like "The intelligence of Peyton Manning and athletism of Michael Vick" would've gotten the point across without sounding as racially charged. Still means the same thing - what everyone else is thinking- but you don't offend people as much.

 

[TheBandwagon]

Still means the same thing - what everyone else is thinking- but you don't offend people as much.

The unfortunate thing is even if you apply the tact you're referring to, people are still gonna be offended. Their reaction will be slightly different, from, "gee, what a racist" to, "so uh, what exactly are you implying?"

People shouldn't risk getting banned for telling the truth. And the "black QB stereotype" is true. I mean look at who all the dual threat type QBs have been over the years and look at who they are now. I have my own theories on why dual threat QBs don't tend to have as refined pure QB skills as a less mobile QB and it has little or nothing to do with intelligence. While developing, they've just spent far more time running the ball for one thing. And regardless of race or whatever, the more athletic a player is, the more it tends to get relied upon to get it done, especially at the amateur levels. The less athletic, the more you have to rely on developing the finer skills of the sport.

One difference with the dual threat QBs now, like Wilson, G3 and CK, is not only can they still run like the wind but they have the pure QB skills to match, which hasn't been typical in the past. G3 I think pretty much proves my theory correct because the reason behind his pure QB skills stems from him adapting his game after he got hurt in college and couldn't run for a while anymore. The skills were underdeveloped before that, as is typical of the type of QB he was.

The problem with PC people is that they think it's inappropriate and racist to acknowledge those differences. It isn't. It's all about being tolerant of the differences, not to deny they exist.

 

[sprhawk]

I personally am not offended by that stuff. I'm Ukrainian, a very ethnocentric and racist ethnic group. But at the same time I can see how that could be taken the wrong way. And it's not about political correctness, it's more about simple respect for your fellow man. Even if there is truth in what you say, sometimes, in a setting such as a football message board, it's better not to say 'intelligent white QB vs. Athletic but dumb black QB' even if most people would agree, it's better to not say stuff like that. Something like "The intelligence of Peyton Manning and athletism of Michael Vick" would've gotten the point across without sounding as racially charged. Still means the same thing - what everyone else is thinking- but you don't offend people as much.

Thanks, that was pretty deep bro, and damn good advice.

I guess the Irish in me struggles with it all. I figure there is good and bad about everything and many various points of view on what good or bad is. But using common sense and learning from mistakes isn't hate or discrimination, it's smart and you should never let anyone No one should tell you to ignore your conscience.

A duck is a duck, even if you call it a goose.

The reason I call it politically correct is because the government is the best example of glossing over the truth. They are the masters of waste, misdirection and sweeping under the rug.

If you breed animals you choose the traits your looking for. Don't pick the ones that bite. If you pretend they don't bite... well.

 

[#ONE]

The unfortunate thing is even if you apply the tact you're referring to, people are still gonna be offended. Their reaction will be slightly different, from, "gee, what a racist" to, "so uh, what exactly are you implying?"

People shouldn't risk getting banned for telling the truth. And the "black QB stereotype" is true. I mean look at who all the dual threat type QBs have been over the years and look at who they are now. I have my own theories on why dual threat QBs don't tend to have as refined pure QB skills as a less mobile QB and it has little or nothing to do with intelligence. While developing, they've just spent far more time running the ball for one thing. And regardless of race or whatever, the more athletic a player is, the more it tends to get relied upon to get it done, especially at the amateur levels. The less athletic, the more you have to rely on developing the finer skills of the sport.

One difference with the dual threat QBs now, like Wilson, G3 and CK, is not only can they still run like the wind but they have the pure QB skills to match, which hasn't been typical in the past. G3 I think pretty much proves my theory correct because the reason behind his pure QB skills stems from him adapting his game after he got hurt in college and couldn't run for a while anymore. The skills were underdeveloped before that, as is typical of the type of QB he was.

The problem with PC people is that they think it's inappropriate and racist to acknowledge those differences. It isn't. It's all about being tolerant of the differences, not to deny they exist.

I have no issue with someone saying "Black QB's have a tendency to be more athletic". It’s when you follow that up with and “combined with an INTELLIGENT white QB”, it implies that that Black QB's are dumb.....

I don't even know why I'm talking about this... I'm probably the biggest bigot on here. I just keep it in my circle of close friends who can laugh about it and won’t get offended. This isn't that circle of friends and I try to do my best job at using common sense and good judgment out of respect for people who I may not know or that don’t share similar views with me.

 

[sprhawk]

I have no issue with someone saying "Black QB's have a tendency to be more athletic". It’s when you follow that up with and “combined with an INTELLIGENT white QB”, it implies that that Black QB's are dumb.....

I don't even know why I'm talking about this... I'm probably the biggest bigot on here. I just keep it in my circle of close friends who can laugh about it and won’t get offended. This isn't that circle of friends and I try to do my best job at using common sense and good judgment out of respect for people who I may not know or that don’t share similar views with me.

Role reversal. A good debate is fun but it's nice to not have a bunch of extremists censoring on this site.

I think the people that fly off the handle are the ones who have issues. Freedom of speech should mean just that. People perceive things however they want anyway. I can't say I've had tons of friends in my life but of the ones I have, they come in all shapes and sizes.

I guess a better way to say it is as far as it goes in the NFL, most black QB's haven't seemed to be high in football IQ. And we've seen plenty of gangly white QB's who lacked athletic ability. I luv Hass but dude was scary sometimes.

 

[insidetracktix]

Wilson is definitely the better qb...kaep is not as consistent and is weaker